Why Promotions Go Sideways

Ty Cobb Backer 0:00

Episode 347 Why being great at your job isn't enough.

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We have a kind of a belief system that either we're gonna push you up or gonna push you out.

Ty Cobb Backer 0:10

I don't want to be around five other people that aren't pushing themselves to succeed.

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Success isn't about taking, but giving value first. Compensation follows contribution always. This is true authenticity. It's the truth. Every week, this is our story. We share with you our journey, we share with you our scars. Please welcome your host, Ty Cobb Backer.

Ty Cobb Backer 0:32

Hey, hey, hey, welcome back, everybody. Let's freaking go. Happy Wednesday. Welcome back to Behind the Tool Belt. I appreciate everyone checking in with us. Whether you are driving between appointments, sitting in your truck, walking a job site, sitting on your couch, relaxing after work, I want to thank you for spending a part of your day with us. And today, today we're going to talk about something that I think almost every business owner, manager, team member should or will eventually experience. And that should be promoted. Where I think most people believe that if you're really good at your job, naturally you'll become a great leader. Unfortunately, unfortunately, I think I think that's one of the biggest the biggest lies, one of the biggest myths in business. This, you know, the the skills that that that got you promoted are often often not the skills that that will make that will make you successful after you get promoted. Okay, so think about it. The best roofers get promoted to a production manager, the best, the best salespeople become uh sales managers, the best technician become service manager, so on and so forth. Okay. The assumption, the assumption is is simple. Okay. They're amazing at the work. Okay. So I think you would think that they would be amazing at at leading the work. Okay. But leadership, leadership is an entirely different profession. Okay. So today, today we're going to talk about why why that transition is so difficult and how to avoid, I think, the the biggest, the biggest mistake and and what separates managers from from true leaders.

Birthday Reflections And Core Four

Ty Cobb Backer 3:03

And I guess before we get started here, thank you. Thank you for all the birthday wishes. I got to spend some time this morning. There's a local gentleman here. A lot of you guys know of him. And his name is Eric Brewer. And he's been hosting probably over a year now. This this thing that he calls Core Four. And it's every Wednesday morning. And typically Wednesday mornings, you know, I try to keep things semi-monotone. You know, I get prepared for for the podcast and review, you know, some notes. I jot down some things that I want to talk about and just try to keep it light. And then after the podcast, you know, go go full board into the rest of my day. But this morning, I decided to go over there. One, he he personally invited me to come out because there was a local gentleman who is a football coach and and has his own training business, but but also coaches for for high school football. And he was coming in to share his experience and some of his successes and failures and how he handled his, you know, all of this is and and a lot of it was was kind of faith-based, and it was good. It was just a real good way for me to start my morning. And and meanwhile, since one 1 05 a.m. this morning, I've been getting messages from people wishing me a happy birthday. And on my way over there, you know, I was thinking about, you know, and I'm gonna probably tell on myself here a little bit, and and maybe other people are guilty of this as well. But, you know, I was thinking about, you know, how we celebrate life, you know, after somebody's funeral, and and and you know, today's my birthday. And it's like, I I, you know, I'm guilty of not celebrating people's lives while they're here. And why do we only celebrate people's lives after they have passed? And and again, I'm I'm the one that that maybe it's just me, you know, that I don't take enough time out of my day to wish somebody a happy birthday. You know, as as so many of you have, I mean, it's over over 200 people, individuals, and that was probably like two hours ago. But starting at 1 05 a.m. this morning, my dad was my first one. I believe Vic may have been the second one. I almost I almost told Vic that he was the first one, but then I realized that my dad at 105, he probably had to get up to pee or something like that because I I know he's not a night owl like that. So he probably didn't want to forget. And God bless him, but my dad and then uh hundreds of other people have have reached out to me in some way, shape, or form. And thank you. Thank you for for celebrating my life today. It's my birthday, and it only makes sense to, I think, celebrate someone's life. And I'm not saying, you know, it's a great way to to sugarcoat after someone has passed is to celebrate their life, and and it's great, and we should definitely do that. But for me, it's probably more of a morning, morning their life, and and but but celebrate and camaraderie and and reminisce, okay, while we're still here. I think I think we can all probably learn something from that. Like I think we should, I think I should do a better job of reminiscing with those that I love more often, and it doesn't necessarily have to be on their birthday. So thank you. And I love I love every single one of you. And but today, to get to today's topic, and I'll also be Eric invited me to speak at his core four. Any anyone's welcome to attend his core four. If you know Eric, check out his his social, I'm sure it's on there. I I'm not exactly sure when I'll be speaking, but I'll I'll I'll probably be sharing my experience, strength, and hope there with a group of like-minded individuals. It was it was nice. It wasn't just for business owners. There was leaders from all different industries and and owners and and you know, team members. It was it was just great. If you're if you're into personal development, core four stands for faith, family, friends, friends and family, faith, family, friends, health, and and finances. So if you're into any of that stuff, which I'm sure most of us that watch this show will get something out of it. So and I'll let you know what date that is that I'll actually be sharing. So it'll be about 8:30 on a Wednesday at some point in

The Mindset Shift From Doing

Ty Cobb Backer 8:02

time. So, anyhow, today I want to talk about probably one of the hardest things that I had to do myself in a transition of managing myself, managing people to graduating to what I I like to call leadership. And and I know a lot of us have struggled with it. I know it's probably one of my biggest fears, one of my biggest things that my ego and pride have gotten in the way and have held myself back, have held other people back, and quite frankly held held back our our companies. So why why why being great at your job doesn't automatically make you a great leader? Okay. One of my favorite sayings, and you've probably have heard me say this a dozen times on here, is what got you here won't get you there. You know, success creates opportunity and leadership creates multiplication. Okay. Those are those are two different things. When when you're in an individual, when when you're an individual contributor, your your value comes from from like what you produce. Okay, you install roofs, you close sales, you solve customers' problems, you answer the phone, you estimate the the projects. Okay. Your success is measured by your own performance. Okay. But once you're promoted, okay, your success is no longer measured by what you accomplish. It is measured by what your team accomplishes. Okay. And that's a massive, and I mean huge mindset shift, at least for me. Okay, your job changes from doing, from doing to developing, okay, and I'll explain that a little bit. Okay, from from producing to multiplying, from solving every problem to teaching others how to solve problems. And honestly, for me, that was probably the most uncomfortable thing I had ever had to do in my career because the very thing that made me valuable, I thought, my ability to do the work is now something I have to slowly let go of. Okay. That was probably one of the hardest parts for me. All right. Probably the toughest transition that I had to make, and probably anyone else ever has to make, right? So, because like, you know, when somebody gets promoted, you know, today, right? Yesterday they were joking around with everybody, right? So now today they're responsible for performance reviews. Yesterday they were all venting together, and today, today we have to coach accountability. Okay. Everyone, everyone was equal, but today people are watching every word we say. Leadership changes, unfortunately, relationships. Not because you're better than anyone, but because your responsibility has changed. You know, that was, you know, and anybody that has been in a position like that where it's like they're work, they have worked with like their best friend. And there's been instances where I've watched where, you know, people get resentful because they think they thought they deserved the promotion, you know, and it's tough to hold your best friend accountable. There's been certain situations where it just didn't go over so well because the other person thought that they deserved the raise or the promotion. And I think what happens is it there becomes like this lack of respect and immaturity that takes place instead of celebrating that person's win and helping them achieve and allowing them to help grow the company. You know, I think that's where the difference is. You know, people get resentful opposed to celebrating each other, kind of what I was talking about earlier, but not really. But but one of the biggest, biggest mistakes I think new leaders make is trying to remain, you know, everyone's best friend. Okay. Listen, you you can absolutely care deeply about people and you should. Okay. But leadership requires difficult conversations. Sometimes you'll have to correct people. Okay. Sometimes you'll have to challenge them. And sometimes you'll have to say no. And for me, that was probably the hardest thing because I wanted everybody to like me. I want everybody to love me, I want everyone to like all of my decisions. I don't want people to be mad at me. But there's much more at stake here. Okay. If you're more concerned with being liked than respected, you'll avoid the conversation leadership requires. Okay. Great leaders aren't cold, they're courageous, they're bold. Okay.

Liked Vs Respected In Leadership

Ty Cobb Backer 13:25

So before we get going here much further, each week we've been trying to do a little poll. And I I really I really enjoy hearing from everybody. And now that I can see the screen a lot better over here and see everybody's comments, and I can actually see myself. Thank you, Tina. Thank you, Jana. I love you very much. Hi, Mike Hanscom. Thank you, Pete, Your Slacker, John Boy, Kim. Love all of you guys. So while you guys are on here listening to me, dribble my lip. Here's here's today's poll. Okay. What let me see if I can remember this. What's the hardest part of becoming a new leader? Okay, I'm gonna give you four options to choose from here. Letting go of control, leading former co-workers, making decisions, developing other people. What has been the hardest part of becoming a new leader? Okay, letting go of control, leading former co-workers, making decisions, developing other people. And quite honestly, it this is gonna be a hard one because I've struggled with every single one of these. So I couldn't tell you personally which one would be. I mean, shit, making decisions is tough, leading former co-workers. I mean, letting go of control, that's probably in the top five. And I would say also in the top five for me is is developing other people is hard because for a long time it was all it was all about me. Drop your answers in the comments or or message me what you think. So I'd I'd really because I I do enjoy this, and I'd love to know, I'd love to know what other people are struggling with. And how it doesn't even have to be any of those four that I had mentioned, but but let me know. Let me know what you guys are struggling with. And and I bet it's probably a lot of the same stuff that that I've struggled with over the

Stop Saving People And Start Coaching

Ty Cobb Backer 15:36

past. So anyhow, I want to share with you something personal, you know, as I you know have have gone through this entrepreneurial journey and this entrepreneurship, you know, as a business owner, we're we're usually promoted because we built the company. But but no one, you know, and I used to think that no one no one can do it as well as I can. Okay. At least that's that's what what I believed. And and I am so freaking guilty of this, you know. We we tend to tell ourselves, I can do it faster. Get out of the way. And maybe that's true. Okay, but every time you do every time you do someone else's job, you're training them to depend on you. Instead, instead, leaders ask questions, okay? What do you think? I've talked about this before, okay. What do you think? These are the questions we should be asking, okay. Instead of instead of just doing it, okay. What do you think? How would you solve this? What options have you considered? Have been some of the most powerful questions. It does so many different things. It empowers them. It lets you it lets you lets them know that that you trust them and their thinking. Okay. And what we're doing is when we're asking those questions, we're developing thinking. Okay. I used to have people, I used to train people, I didn't even know it, what to think. Okay. Until I discovered that that I was teaching people on what to think and not necessarily training them how to think on their own. Okay. I was training, I was training people dependency and not independency. And that's that right there in itself is a leadership truth. Okay. If your team always needs you, you you haven't built leaders, you've built followers. Okay. And I had a lot of followers. I had a great team. Okay. But I wasn't developing other leaders, I was creating dependency. Okay. Real leaders create independence, not dependency. Okay, so be careful with that.

Bottlenecks And Creating Heroes

Ty Cobb Backer 18:15

You know, and imagine promoting, you know, and and I've done this and I've seen this, and I see this a lot in other businesses, where we promote our best salesperson to manage. Okay. But but instead of them coaching, they keep selling. Instead of them training, they jump into every appointment, you know, and instead of like reviewing the numbers, they're the ones actually closing all the deals. And eventually the team stops growing. Okay, because the manager never became a leader. They simply became the company's highest paid salesperson. And this happens everywhere. It's happened here. I've seen it in other businesses, not just the roofing industry. I've watched it, it happens everywhere where the production manager is still running every job. The office, the office manager is answering every phone call, the owner solves every complaint, the estimator writes every estimate. And at first, it does feel productive, I admit. Okay, but long term, it becomes a bottleneck. And I've talked about this a million times where I've become the bottleneck. I've created bottlenecks in other departments. Like I've seen it and I've allowed it to happen. And what it does, it stunts the growth of individuals, not just individuals, but the business as a whole. The organization cannot grow. Right? It never, it can never grow past the leader's personal capacity. Okay. The leader leadership isn't about, and this is what I used to think. It isn't about being a hero, it's about creating heroes. Okay. And here's another lesson that took me years, years to fully understand. Sometimes the people you're leading know the technical job better than you do. And that is okay. That is great. Leadership doesn't require you to know everything, it requires you to create clarity, it requires you to create vision, accountability, a culture, and direction. Okay. Some of the smartest people I've ever hired know far more about the the specialty, you know, position than I have ever had. Okay. And honestly, that's exactly how I wanted it. Okay. If you're always the smartest person in the room, you've probably hired the wrong people. Great leaders don't have all the answers. I will never have all the answers. I I need to ask better questions today. I need to remove the the obstacles. I need to provide resources. We need to create environments where talented people can succeed. Okay. Leadership isn't less about having all the knowledge. Wait a minute. I'm having a brain fart. Why do I do that? Sometimes I'll get on a roll. Leadership is less. Okay. About it is less about having all the knowledge and more about helping everyone else use theirs. I think that makes sense. Okay. I think that's what. I was trying to say. I think we got some people on here learning leading former co-workers. Yeah. Pete, that's a good one. Letting go of control, but it's different for everyone. It really is, Philip. Yeah, all the above. Ain't that the truth, Dick? Call them. Yeah, I never call them employees either, team members, for sure. No doubt. Anyhow, leadership is less about having all the knowledge and more about helping everyone use theirs. Okay. So I'll share something that I've experienced.

Leading Through Growth And Scale

Ty Cobb Backer 22:39

Okay. As our company grew, I I started to realize something. The way the way I led when we had when we had five people couldn't work when we had 50. And and and what worked with 50 wouldn't work with 100. So early on, I was involved in almost everything. Okay. Every decision, every problem, every opportunity. You know, that worked. It it worked until it didn't. Okay. Growth. Growth forced me. It actually forced me to become someone different. It was very uncomfortable. I had to learn new skills. I had to learn different mindset. I mean, so many different things. But instead of making every decision, I had to develop decision makers. Instead of solving every problem, I had to teach them how to problem solve. Instead of building the business myself, I had to build leaders who could build the business. And honestly, that wasn't easy. Sometimes stepping back felt like I was losing control. But actually, I was I was creating capacity. You know, leadership isn't about doing more, it's about enabling more. And that's, I think that was probably one of my biggest struggles, one of my biggest learning curves, you know, throughout this whole journey that I'm still on. Okay.

Five Rules For New Leaders

Ty Cobb Backer 24:23

If you're new, I want to share this too. If you're if you're new to this whole leadership thing, there's there's there's five things, four or five things that I want to share with you. Okay, that that that I want you to remember. Okay, so so try write these down if you have to. Okay. Number one, these are things that that that have helped me. Okay. I needed to stop measuring myself by by what I accomplished. Okay. I needed to start measuring myself by what my team accomplished. Okay, that's that's number one. That was probably the hardest thing. Okay. Number two, coach. I had to coach more. I have to, I have to become a better coach than I am at correcting. People, I feel like people grow faster when they're developed instead of criticized. Okay. Number three. This was a hard one too, and it was hard for me to differentiate. Delegate outcomes, not just task. Give give ownership, not just assignments. Okay. And Vic is a perfect example of that. Okay. And many other people in this building. Number four, have the difficult conversations early and often. Avoiding conflict creates bigger problems later. Okay. And I think finally, never stop, and this is probably the most important thing for me to listen to right now, and it's never stop learning leadership. Technical skills may earn promotions. Leadership skills sustain them. Okay, I'm going to say that again. Never stop learning leadership. Technical skills may earn promotions, but leadership skills sustain them. Okay.

The Skill That Now Holds You Back

Ty Cobb Backer 26:31

Before we wrap up here, I want to leave you guys with one one more question here. Okay. But could actually hold you back in your new one? Okay, think about it. All right. What skill helped you succeed in your old role, but could actually hold you back in your new one? Okay, this is something I had to ask myself. So think about it. Maybe, maybe it was perfectionism. Maybe it's control. Maybe it's independence. Maybe it's solving every problem yourself. You know, because sometimes our greatest strengths can can become our greatest limitations. Okay. So think about that. And be honest with yourself, too. Being a doer, Scope. Get her done. So, anyhow, if today's episode challenged your thinking, do me a favor. Okay. I don't see enough people sharing this. Share this episode out. Okay. I want to know. I want to see also who who's stepping, who's stepping up and who's stepping into, you know, leadership. You know, and then share this. Share this with someone who who may be a new manager, a business owner, maybe it's someone who's been promoted recently, who's trying to figure out, you know, what what the next steps are, because leadership isn't about titles. And that's the thing I can't stand about some people that I might see in leadership positions. And I'm going to tell you exactly what it is. It's not a title, it's about influence. It's about serving others. It's about serving people. It's about making others better because I showed up, because you showed up, making people better just by simply showing up. Okay. So thank you. Thank you so much for all the birthday wishes. Thank you so much for listening to another episode of Behind the Tool Belt. If you enjoyed today's conversation, please don't forget to like, love, subscribe, share it. Until next time, keep building, keep growing, and remember the greatest project you'll ever build isn't a company. Okay. It's the people inside it. We'll see you next episode of Behind the Tool Belt.

Final Thanks And Sponsors

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Thanks to our sponsors, TC Backer Construction, Hook Roofing Marketing, Roofal, and Project Map It. And thank you for watching. Subscribe to our YouTube channel and follow us on Facebook. We are streaming on all major platforms. See you next week for another episode of Behind the Tool Belt.