Why Value Lands Differently

Ty Cobb Backer 0:00

Episode 333. Nobody, not everybody feels valued the same way.

SPEAKER_02 0:07

We have a kind of a boost system that either we're gonna push you up, we're gonna push you out.

Ty Cobb Backer 0:12

I don't want to be around five other people that are pushing themselves.

SPEAKER_02 0:16

That isn't about it, but giving value for compensation always contribution. Always. It's the true contribution. It's the truth. Every group, this is our story. We share with you our journey. We share with you our scars. Please welcome your host, Ty Cobb Backer.

Ty Cobb Backer 0:34

And welcome back to Behind the Tool Belt, everybody. Today's gonna be an amazing conversation. Got a good good friend on with us. And you know, I I just you know, I've I've studied this and and I'm really looking forward to uh this conversation that we're we're about to have. And if you've ever felt like, you know, if you're you're pouring into your team, but but nothing is landing, and and if you've ever thought, man, I'm doing everything I can, why don't they feel it? And I just it's funny because I just had a conversation with with one of my sales managers today about this topic. And and so today's episode is is gonna hit home. I I at least for me and I hope for somebody else, because the truth is that nobody feels valued the same way. Okay, and if and if you're speaking the wrong language uh as a leader, you might be creating distance without even realizing it. So, anyhow, welcome back to Behind the Toolbelt. I'm your host Ty Backer, and today's episode is is 333 of these things that we've done continuously, week after week after week. And and we have an amazing conversation lined up with Reggie Brock today. And we're gonna be diving into a concept that every leader thinks that they understand, but I think very few actually get it. And and that's what Reggie calls the the love language of business. And and you see in in relationships, we we know not everyone receives love the same way. Some people need words, some need action, some just need your time, you know. And I know a lot of times my my grandkids just want my time. Doesn't matter what we're doing, we're just sitting on the floor playing. Well, business is no different. Okay, some some people on your team might need clarity, some some need trust, some need recognition, and and some just need to know that they matter. But uh but here here's the problem, I think that that most uh that most leaders you know give value the way that they receive it, not the way their people actually experience it. And and I think what happens is that that creates frustration for you, for them, disengagement, and sometimes even quiet quitting. And I heard Reggie that probably coined that phrase a long time ago. So today we're gonna unpack that on how to recognize it, how to fix it, and and how to become a leader that that can truly connect with their people. So, Reggie, welcome to the stage, my friend.

SPEAKER_01 3:10

Man, thank you so much, Ty. It's good to see you. I always enjoy our conversations, and I don't think today's gonna be any different.

The Towel Story And Real Value

Ty Cobb Backer 3:17

Same here, brother. I I really look forward to this. And you know, what this podcast has has really done for me, uh, you know, is is it it's done several things. It is allowed me to surround myself with people as as intelligent as you are, and and who have come before me and have experienced the things already that I'm experiencing now. And and we kind of had a short conversation earlier, you know, when you know you're coming into your fourth season, and now you know you're finding a a place where you're you're you're able to sink your teeth into and pour into other people and and find what your your your purpose was all along, but now you really get to devote your time, your full time to pouring into people. And I guess, you know, let's just set the 10 right now. You know, with the when it comes to this this whole love language thing of, you know, so when you say love language is a business, what does that actually look like inside a company? And what computers get this wrong?

SPEAKER_01 4:22

Yeah, so you said something a minute ago that I think is a great stage setter, and that is we give value the way we receive it. Well, what if everybody doesn't receive value the way you do? You're kind of caught in between. And so for me, this business love language was just another extension of a book I read that was that that talked about love languages between husbands and wife in particular. And I'll give you a great story, I think. My wife and I now have been married 37 years, Connie and I have been married 37 years, and we hadn't been married that long. And you have to understand, I came out of an environment being raised where my dad was such an encourager, he was somebody that just, you know, even if I messed up, he's you know, you know, you're he'll tell me stuff like your comeback needs to be more noticeable than your setbacks. And so I had this mindset of like, you know, I just if you can validate me, I will probably be more apt to succeed, and everybody's happier with my outcomes. And so I got married. And Connie is one of the most uh, you know, I I she is the epitome of what I feel like love is. Like she understands forgiveness, she's understood, you know, giving of herself more, you know, as a priority as opposed to requiring so much from me. But right after we got married, we were both working and you know, we were kind of having some long days and at night, so some of the house chore kind of stuff was like just left undone at times. So I came in one day after a hard day of work and I noticed that there were some towels in the driver, and so I got them and I fold them, and I'm thinking to myself, this is gonna be a way for me to prove I love her, and she's just gonna validate me, and everything is gonna be great. Well, she walks in and tie, I stood basically over those towels like they were a golden calf, like I had given her a million dollars or something, and she didn't even get it, she didn't even notice it. She just kind of went on with her life, and finally I got frustrated because I'm used to being validated, I'm used to being how great you are, Reggie, all that, and she's not cut like that. And so finally she said, What do you do? You know, what's the problem here? And I said, I walk in after a hard day's work and I fold these towels, and you don't even acknowledge them. And she said, Well, I'll acknowledge them for you. They're folded wrong. And so, like, I didn't want to make a big deal out of it because you don't even know how to fold towels. She said, How much time do you spend telling me thank you for the dinner that I've prepared or the clothes that I've washed of yours or whatever? And so what I learned from that is this my wife is not impressed or feeled love when I buy her flowers or give her chocolate or whatever it is. You know what she really is impressed with and what speaks her language is when I serve her. When I decide that acts of service are the way I prove to her how much I care for her, that rang true to her. So when I would do things for her to serve her without needing validation, there was a growth that happened in our marriage that was critically important. And I think the same is true in business. We don't we have come to believe that if we pay people enough money, they're gonna want to stay and they're gonna be happy, they're gonna feel loved and valued. Well, some people don't operate like that, some of them just want you to fold the towels right. Like some of them just want you to go like, hey, thanks for showing up today. Your contribution matters. We can't be who we really want to become without you. Everybody, their value, their love language or the way they feel valued looks different. And so understanding people tie in terms of what motivates them and what drives them and what really engages them in your life is so important. And that's the data I'm trapping. Is when I first come into a company, I want to know what motivates them. Like I oh each person individually, do they need to be, is it, you know, is it, you know, do they they do they does their contribution need to be noticed, maybe a little bit more than other people do, or maybe it is a compensation thing, or whatever it is. Finding people's why, their motivation, what drives them, how they show up every day is critical to assembling a great team. And so to me, that's the first step of everything. Do I understand? So if you brought me in a room with people who speak Spanish regularly, I'm out, dude. I don't speak Spanish, I don't understand Spanish. I think it's a beautiful language, but I cannot communicate in that language. So think about it. If you got somebody walking into your business every day and the way you communicate with them does not resonate with them, you may be able to easier understand why they disconnect, maybe why performance slightly it becomes less, or maybe there's conflicts, it seems unresolved. It's because many times we just don't speak the right language, we don't understand what motivates them and drives them. And that's one of the things I try to help companies do. Find out what everybody's individual value stack looks like and how do we serve that?

Ty Cobb Backer 9:58

Man, that's good. That's so good. And you know, personally, this this is a good time for for me to to be listening to this. Rajia, I would like to sit here and say, you know, I've I've I nailed this. I nail this every single day. And there hasn't been a season in my career where I was absolutely perfect at it. But I I'll be honest with you, you know, there have been periods of time where I've let off the gas, I guess, you know, for lack of words. And where I've gotten distracted by, you know, whether it was personal things or even professional things, where you know, I wasn't able to necessarily work on the business. I found myself, you know, falling back into the weeds and I couldn't see the force through the trees and other things became more important to me than my people. I felt like, you know, if if if you know, for a great example would be cash flow. Cash flow slows down. You know, of course, you know, I gotta figure out why. Why did the cash flow, you know, and that's one of the things that you know will will get me in in survival mode real quick. And I'll kind of put my blinders on. And, you know, I'm trying to generate more revenue, I'm trying to save cost, I'm trying to do all these things. And I and when I get in that mode, I tend to lack in that area of of you know, acknowledging my team, you know, and if I am acknowledging them, it's usually words of like, you're spending too much money, you know, why it takes so long to do that job? Like everything that we're talking about right now just kind of goes out the window, you know. So for me to to listen to what you're saying, and and and I guess if there's a question in there, Reggie, how how you know, unfortunately, I guess before I before I wrap this up, fortunately, I I have been a good boy and have built what I call a trust bank. Yeah, you know, been a good boy enough, and I've acknowledged my team long enough. And and we we don't have very much turnover here. There's a lot of people who've been here for deck over decades, you know. And and uh they love me, I love them, and and and they I I but yeah, I feel like this this last I don't even want to call it a season. This there was a period over this past winter, I'd say coming out of Q3 and the Q4, and even a little bit into Q1 of this year, I was in a funk.

SPEAKER_00 12:18

Yeah.

Ty Cobb Backer 12:19

Where where my where I used to live was acknowledging the team, doing community events, being real strong and and pulling the team together to perform these community events. And that's one way that I've been able to pull us all together as a family and and create such a great culture, but like I lacked in that department because other things have become more important, I felt at that time, but I I knew I felt it. Like I didn't even want to talk.

Build A Destination Business

SPEAKER_01 12:44

So every there's multiple layers of business, and so you don't have you only got so much time, right? Like you can't have 17 oars in the water with two arms, like you there's just there's just too much going on. But what I I know is this pressure is what reveals what you've built, and and so if even in relationships, you don't know what kind of relationship you have to pressure's applied. And so one of the things that you've done very well, I've noticed your people, I noticed the interaction that you have with them when I've seen them in events. Even when there's a conflict, it doesn't damage and create separation, it's just a bump, like it's like a parking lot collision, not one that we run into each other 60 miles an hour. That's healthy because that's that trust you've built, where even if we have differences, look, and I'm not talking about coddling people, I'm not talking about petting people, I'm just talking about understanding people well enough to know so that there is a level of trust built with each other. So when we have an off day or we ignore them or they ignore us or something, it's not that it doesn't break what we're building. It just reveals to us, okay, wait a minute. Now I need to slow down. I can't do it right now, Ty, but I promise you, you're on my radar. I know there's some things that are often missing. I've got to keep my eye on this right now, but understand I'm coming back and we're gonna have these conversations that have mattered to us over the past, as well as the things that are gonna secure us for our future. I think you've done that very, very well from what I've seen. I think though people, owners in particular, may be asking their own questions. And I think the question that a lot of guys are asking right now is why can't I why why am I losing people? Why are people leaving me? And I think that's their own question. I think the right question is why would they stay? Like you have built a business that people I call it a destination business, you know, where people come and stay, they want to stay. And it's not just because you're so great, though you are, it's that you've built a condition, an environment where people realize everything that I want to be, I can do right here. And buddy, that is a gift, and most people build their business around their dreams and what they want out of life to come about. When you can build a business that makes room for other people's dreams, why would they leave? So you gotta think about what are we doing that keeps people? We're really good at attracting, but we're horrible at most people. I'm not saying everybody, but most people just don't understand the ingredients that creates that stickiness inside of an organization where people not only don't want to leave, they can't see their self leaving. And so I had people, I spoke at an event south by southwest a couple months back, big event, and I was with a room in a room with a bunch of creative people, and so I was nervous as a cat on a tin roof, if you want to know the truth, because I'm like, I don't know these people, I don't understand why they're in this room. There's no roofers that I can see, so what am I doing in here? And so I went around and listened to some of the speakers before me and I watched the audience, and I still wasn't convinced, but to about 15 minutes before I went on stage, I just changed my presentation, and that was scary in itself. But the reason I did is I had gone up to some of these highly creative people who work for Fortune 50 companies, packed into this room, now entrepreneurs, and they said, and I went up and I'd asked them, hey Ty, why did you leave Google at such a high-level job? It wasn't the money, was it? No, I was making more money I could spend. Was the environment good? Yeah, the environment was good. They, you know, they and they list all these things. Why did you leave? Listen to this. They said, because what I am becoming, I couldn't become there. And so I think that we generally look at transitions with people as they're just we just training our competitors, and they and the fact of the matter is maybe what we're building doesn't support what they're wanting to become. And so I help just put eye line on like, okay, what keeps these people? Who would keep all of these people who've been with Ty for so long? And then how do we amplify that as opposed to like trying to figure out why all these exits are happening? And I'll leave you with one before we transition. My grandfather, and you may have seen this video, it was it's most viewed video I've ever done. It was about me and my grandfather. My grandfather, I would work in his garden in the summer, and it wasn't an acre garden, but it was enough to where we fed our families, our extended families, and he gave a bunch of food to the community. My last summer there, I went to him and I said, Pawpaw, every year I've been here since I could walk hardly, work in this garden. And I said, I've noticed something as I re I've thought back over this. We've always had more than we can eat. He said, You know what that's called, son? I said, No, sir. He said, It's called the law of plenty. Time, my grandfather had never made it past fourth grade, and he understood that principle, and here's the way he explained it. He took me over and he said, Grab a handful of that seed. So I picked some seed up and we walked to his front patio, and he said, Son, throw that seed down on that concrete right there. And I'm like, What do you what? He said, Throw it down there. So I threw it down there, and he said, Now go over and get the he called it a hose pipe. And he said, So he I brought the water hose over there and he said, I put pour water on these seeds. And I said, Papa, why would I do that? He said, Well, does seed need water? I said, Yes, it needs water. I said, but vegetables will not grow on concrete. He said, That's the principle. I said, What do you mean? He said, To operate in the law of plenty, somebody watching this today needs to hear this. If you want plenty in your business, there are two things that must coexist, and that's good seed and good soil. He said, Reggie, that's good seed that you threw on bad soil, it'll never grow, it's gonna wither and die no matter how much you water it. This is what I'm telling owners. It may not be a seed problem. You just have a hard soil, and when you drop it, you've met these guys. I want five-star recruits, I want the A game players, and then these A pet players come in and they try to go to work there, and the ground is so hard, there's no way for there to be growth, development of the seed, and so there shouldn't, there can never be a harvest. And here's what we say Oh, I just got a bag run of bad people. No, you haven't. What you have done is you've let great seed fall on hard ground and it will not grow and produce plenty. My suggestion to owners is you've got to sow and toil the soil, and your soil is your business environment. So when a mediocre seed is planted in your soil, it'll still bring forth a harvest. So one of my cryouts today to people is stop being obsessed with seed and start working your soil as a business owner. And the opportunity for that law of plenty to reside in your business increases exponentially. It takes seed and it takes soil.

Ty Cobb Backer 20:28

Yeah, that's so good. All of that's so good. I don't even know where to start after all that because there was so much good stuff coming out of that. But you know, what stuck with me was, and I call it re-recruiting your team. That that that had uh that has become you know part of my job today of you know, trying to work on a business and and it, you know, trying to come up with ideas of keeping people engaged and giving them purpose. And I think that's what you were, you know, you're talking about giving them a reason, a purpose to show up every day. And like I had mentioned before, we do outside activities outside work here that that impact our local communities. And that has been a way for us to allow people to get in more involved. We we have, you know, I we haven't really necessarily labeled it as committees, but I'll throw somebody who's usually an introvert into a situation that will pull them out of themselves and get them in front of people to go out. And like last year we did a food drive and and we had a newer gentleman, his name's Jeremy, he might be watching this. I don't know. I think he's been here about two years now. And Jeremy's very quiet. So one of one of the first tasks I assigned him was to take these craftsman tubs. You can go to Lowe's, they're they got red lids with with black bottoms, and we stuck TC Backer stickers on them. And I had him go out to other business owners and let them know, inform them that hey, I'm Jeremy with TC Backer Construction, and we're doing our our fourth or fifth or sixth annual food drive. And would you Like to participate in our food drive, can I place this barrel in your in your four-year here? So then your team can get involved and throw food in, or your customers can come in. And it was one way that I felt like it would make him feel, even though I know he didn't want to do it, but halfway through, I knew he felt like he had purpose and he was on a mission. And by the end of it, so I had placed another individual in the same position that was also introverted. And those two created a competition of how many barrels or these tubs they could get out to different business areas. He weighed all the food when they came back with these tubs to see who who came back with the most most food. So there's little things you can do. Not to get that crazy. I'm a little nutty, so I I we'll we'll do some pretty audacious things, you know. But it's the impact. More audacious we can be, and the and the more people that we allow to get involved. Because see, I used to do all this by myself. I would I would organize all these things myself. I would say, we're gonna do this, and I wouldn't take anybody's input or get get their feedback. But today it's like I want to hear everybody's feedback. What what type of charitable event would you like to do? And and not just that stuff, even when it comes to our KPIs and our SOPs, our standards, like what do you guys think? You know, and that was probably the greatest thing I've ever picked up off of Craig Gerschel. Yeah, I was listening to one of his podcasts, and he he had made a comment about you know, when when somebody comes into their office and they're like, Well, hey boss, what do you think? What do we got this situation and all this is going on? And and he said, There was two things that he said. The first thing was shit, I can't remember, but uh but the one thing that stuck with me was is that he said to them you oh, what do you think? And then he'll listen to them out. What do you what do you think we should do about this situation? And then he'll listen to them, and then he'll say to them, You decide. And when they walk out of that office, and the feeling that they have, what do you think? How do you think we should resolve this situation? And then you decide. You have created such an empowerment, right? Because now it goes from dictatorship to to uh what whatever the opposite of dictatorship is, to holy shit, this guy actually cares about what I think, and he trusts me enough to handle this situation. And at that point in time, you create so much empowerment and trust with with your team. I'm not sure if we lost Reggie. You still there, buddy? Uh-uh. You think his phone died? Okay. But anyhow, yeah, I got a lot of a lot of that stuff from from Craig Grischell. I haven't listened to him for a while. I'm back on the Ed My Lat Kick. The Power of One or One More, The Power of One More. I'm I'm on that, I think it's a RDS. You know, if you if you're thinking about buying a blue car, you know, and it's let's just say it's a Honda blue car, you and then all of a sudden you start seeing all these blue, blue Hondas everywhere. That's that's I don't know what chapter that's on right now, but um that's I was listening to that this morning on the way to work. So if we didn't have a guest this week, I was gonna talk about manifestation and and a little bit of what I've learned about manifesting my thoughts and there he is. You there, buddy? We got you now. You good?

SPEAKER_01 25:55

Man, I'm sorry.

Ty Cobb Backer 25:57

That's okay. No stress whatsoever. That's that's what makes this live and on cut. Uh-oh. Rutro, Raggie. Wait a minute or two here, a second or two. Oh, I hear you. I still hear you, Reggie. Can you hear us? We can hear you, buddy. Just want you to know he probably can't hear us. Yeah, mute his mic real quick. So anyhow. There's there's a lot to to be said about so Jan and I talk about so we we had the experience of of seeing Gary Chapman. He's actually the author of Love Language. And I think it's so funny how weird, you know, how weird this is. I had a conversation with Ben this morning about this topic, but Jan and I also were talking about Gary Chapman's book, The Love Language. And we we were fortunate enough to to listen to him at one of our revolt retreats, uh couple's retreat, and the identifying, you know, and I think half the problem with people don't I think understand that people have love languages, and I think half the battle is is is understanding like oh shit, there's there's love languages, and then the second part to that that battle is is identifying what people's love languages are, okay. And we talk about our kids a lot, and and we're like, oh, Rockets love language is this, McKenzie's is this, Jacob's is that, you know, and I don't necessarily want to review what they are and then what Jana's love language is and what my love language is. And I thanked her the other day because one of my love languages are is you know, and I don't want to think of it as I guess I'm kind of embarrassed because I feel like it's a a shortcoming of mine, but it's it's it's acknowledgement or recognition, and Jana does it without just because the type of person that she is, she thanks me all the time. Like I just want you to know how much, you know, thank you so much for loving me and the family and and always you know putting yourself last and and stuff like that. Yep, we can hear you, buddy.

SPEAKER_00 28:49

Dang, I'm sorry, brother.

Assessing Motivation To Lead Better

Ty Cobb Backer 28:51

That's okay. I was just rambling. I'm I was actually talking about Gary Chapman's book, um the uh love language, and Anna and I, my wife, actually got to see Gary Chapman speak at a revolt couples retreat in Puntacana. And we actually got married there that weekend, and it was and and so we're aware of it. And I was saying, you know, I think most people don't even know that there's a love language. So I think I think that is 50% of the battle is is like, oh shit, people have love languages. And I think the second half of that battle is is identifying what people's love languages are. So I guess if I got a question to for you to jump right back in here, is like, how how do you identify somebody's love, especially within the organization here? Like, if I'm gonna go on a mission, I'm a business owner right now, and it's like, okay, I need to get more involved with my team and I need to meet them where they're at. How would I go about that?

SPEAKER_01 29:49

So we start with an assessment. I'm a certified coach with an organization called the Why Institute. And the Why Institute does exactly what you're saying, it discovers the language and how people show up every day. It's their motivation, it's their core reason for doing what they do. You see, all these other tools and assessments we take generally help direct talent to the right spot. Bus on the seat, that type of deal. Or it really identifies what are characteristics and traits. This is motivation. Here's what I know. If I can find out what your motivation or what you value as and how you show up like that, I can start to strategically putting you in spots with other people who that combination really works for to create outcome that neither of us can get apart. So I we have developed this nine, there's nine different types of motivations or whys. And that's where I start. Is like, for example, I'm what they call a my whys make sense. If I come to a meeting or a conversation, and even I've got the smartest people in the room, if I can't make sense of what they're saying, I freeze. My wife is what they call a right way motivator. So what that means is there are multiple paths to choose from, but she when she finds that right path to get on, that's where she stays. There's no movement from it. There are contributors, people who just wake up every day, and their motivation is how do I contribute to somebody's life today? Because if I do, it'll create gain in mind. There are nine of those. And so what I've done over the last year is I've started working with companies and we identify how their people show up every day, their motivation, which ties into how they sense and feel value, and then we start mapping out strategies internally to create teamwork or collaborations that produce things together that are impossible to do apart. And what it's done is it's lifted that lid off of people to think, well, I can only do so much with so much that I have. And then they start realizing, oh, we could do something together that will produce gain for both of us. Why not try that? And so getting back to Chapman's book, there are these five categories, I think it is. And same thing's true in business. You just got to understand how people are wired, what their internal, I call it, operating system looks like, and then serve them into that area. And then once you're able to have that level of communication to where you understand, okay, I'm getting on a call with this type, this is how they're motivated. What it does is it streamlines the conversation, it gets agreement easier because we're speaking the language each of us understand.

Ty Cobb Backer 32:47

Amen.

SPEAKER_01 32:47

This is not complicated, man. This is about how do we like how do we attract people? How do we get the most out of them for their gain and ours? But more importantly, how do we create connective tissue with these people so that together they can do things that is impossible apart? That's the land that's available to collaborators, it's places individuals can't go alone.

Accountability Without Being A Tyrant

Ty Cobb Backer 33:13

Yeah, yeah. No, that's that's so good. So so I'm I'm familiar with with this. I I've I've by no means have I studied it as much as you have, but being in business as long as I have, I I feel I I think I've run into you know trying to figure out how to balance this idea of meeting people where they are while still holding a high standard in the accountability. So how how do I find that balance? How how do I go from not trying to be too much of a pizza party, you know, captain to you know running the ship with an iron fist? Like how do how do I find that balance and and spot not be a dick and and hold people accountable and and and keep a high performing team?

SPEAKER_00 34:07

You there? Yep, I'm here, buddy. Sorry, go ahead. You blanked out just for a second. I'm good now. Go ahead.

Ty Cobb Backer 34:12

Well, how do how how do I find the balance, you know, it because I've experienced I I have never studied this as long as as as you have, you know, and and I've I've suffered from being a pizza party captain to running the ship with an iron fist. Well, how do I find that balance while while still trying to hold the the the standard high and and hold people accountable?

SPEAKER_01 34:36

Yeah, that's such a good question. And I think it's a battle that most leaders face, and that is they're trying to manage behavior, and it's very, very hard to do it. The first thing is I've quit trying to fix people. And the reason is I'm not capable generally. You know, I may give them some insight and it may be helpful, but the fact is this most people that are are at a behavioral level are in a depth I don't belong, and most leaders don't. So if you can't fix the behavior, how do we affect performance? Well, you do that by creating conditions that are that that people have to be accountable to. Let me give you the four conditions that I think either separate us or glue us together. And these are the things that as owners we have to focus on. If you can't trap and change and require behavioral, what do you do? Like, how do you make people accountable? Well, you have conditions and standards that everybody who's going to be a part of this team has to comply with. And when people start bending those, that's where correction and accountability has to be practiced. So let me give you an example. I think there are four of them that matter. If you can create these types of conditions inside of your business and hold people accountable, listen, to these conditions that move us collectively forward together, you're gonna have a greater opportunity to get past some performance lags. Number one is clarity. If people feel like they understand what they are to do and the benefit that it brings the organization and not have to guess about it, they're gonna stick. If they guess, they're gonna leave. This is this two years of data I've been studying that shows if you build the cut the kind of culture where there's clarity, people stay. And so I'm you, I mean, you and I both heard these where people are like, I don't even understand my compensation model. Or ever, you know, maybe I show up and I know I'm supposed to sell, but is it specific and detailed? Do I understand what I say, when I say it, and how I say it? You've got to create clarity as a standard. And if people bring confusion, they've got to be dealt with. If they operate in confusion, it maybe we haven't taught them well enough. Clarity starts everything. The second thing, and I think that we're really harsh on ourselves about, and rightfully so, is we're poor at communication. We believe frequency solves all problems, and the fact is accuracy does. And so if you go into a room and all you hear is a bunch of noise that doesn't really get clear in message and reach agreement, we just spent 45 minutes and nobody knows what was said. I've done it, I've done it, and I've set more rooms. So now what I'm focused on is how can we deliver a message that has clarity, get agreement on it, and just focus on being accurate. And this then spreads over to our clients and how we're operating with them. The third thing is chemistry, and chemistry is like I was talking about earlier. Once I know people's motivation, and man, I think this is where business owners fail. We're not good at pairing talent. Like we paired the we understand sales needs production, production needs sales, and everybody needs administration, and everybody wants the owner there, so everybody gets paid. But we don't understand at an individual level the power of what I call pollinating, cross-pollinating DNA, where we're we're we're coming in and going, like, oh, this person has this motivation, like, and my motivation is this and how I show up. How do we best tool these people together where their work is filled with flow, not friction? I'm seeing more growth right there than I've ever seen in anything I've ever done in business. Proper pairing inside of businesses. The problem is we have a tendency to hire what we like. So I'll go into companies a lot, and it's all the same people just have different body shapes. You know, that just we have this tendency to hire a particular type of person, and I'm encouraging companies to start looking at what's missing. Like what part of your business needs a particular type of person that's now identified in our assessment, that's who you need to be focused on. And when you start creating this high level of connectivity in chemistry, man, things change. I tell you a quick story. In high school, I was horrible. I had to beg to even pass a chemistry class. But one thing I learned about chemistry was this our world is filled with elements. Some of them put together create explosion, and some of them create new life forms. So hydrogen and oxygen combined together, two parts hydrogen and one part oxygen creates a life source called water. Oxygen by itself, an element by itself, has great value. We breathe because of it. But watch this. Now we have found that combined oxygen with hydrogen and it produces water. Each alone has a potential and adds value. But when you combine certain elements together, it produces something together that neither of them can do apart. Why would you want that in your business? The problem is we're we don't have a plan and a pattern and an understanding about how to properly partner people, put people together to create chemistry that produces things that we can't do alone. That's where I come in and help. So, and then the final thing quickly is creativity. I think vision, this like some of the terms that you hear, like with EOS and some of these other places, is it slots people, and I understand that to a certain degree, but I found a lot of benefit to allowing people that maybe didn't have a role as visionary or they didn't have a role as implementer or whatever, but they have ideas that they have withheld that are the answers to what companies are looking for, but they're just never given the opportunity. One of the first questions I ask people when I go into a business is what is one thing you think you could do that nobody knows that you can do that would help us all get better together? And you would have been shocked at what you've heard. Solutions that owners are looking for, they just are looking in their wrong place. Start with your people. So once we get those conditions where I now have people come to meetings and go, like, you've got you come to contribute, you don't come just to hear. And I give space and time for that in my meeting so that people can resurrect some thoughts or some ideas or some directions that we may have been looking for an answer for, but we've never asked them. So if we manage those four conditions, you spend less time trying to fix people.

Catching Quiet Quitting Early

Ty Cobb Backer 41:36

Yeah, man, that's good. That's so that was good. That was so good. Even my wife was on there saying that's such good stuff because she she she hears me bitching and bickering and and all that. And you know, I do believe in in the chemistry. We we actually just you know matched up on our production side, you know, and I I personally didn't, but I I heard our leadership team over there pairing people up, and it's kind of cool to hear them identify that so-and-so doesn't work so well with so-and-so, but they would be a good fit over there. And it's like, you know, we're all just trying to figure out the you know, the pieces of this puzzle and how we can, you know, streamline things, move things along without a lot a lot less friction and and things like that. And it's like this is so fluid, you know, you know, it's it's never not it's not static. And that's the thing that I've learned over the years, you know, it's like what what was half what worked last year, you know, may not work this year too, because this is the thing too, the longer you're in business, you we've created opportunities to grow, right? For for individuals within the organization. So when what season of life that they came into our organization isn't the same season in life that they're in today. And I think you can identify that and you got to create more opportunity now for them, right? And I think that's part of that re-recruiting thing where it's like, okay, they've grown in the organization, now their goals, their their paradigm has shifted of where they are and where they want to go now. You know what I mean? And I think it's important, you know, if you want to keep them now, now my job today is to create more bigger opportunities because I don't remember who said it. I think might have been Ed Milet, where it's like our dreams have to be big enough for everybody else's dreams to fit too. But when you're when you're stretching their dreams wider, okay, and and now they've come into the organization, they've learned some things, they've brought a lot to the table, they're in a different season of their life, and now their dreams are bigger. Okay, so what happens when you get to that point, I guess. You know, when you've been doing this for a long time, what what now? You know, when they say I've been here for 10, 15, 20 years, like now, now, now what?

SPEAKER_01 43:53

Yeah, I think that's a great question. And I think the answer is pretty simple. You just got to have regularity of conversation. And that might be once a year, it might be once a quarter. You got to know your own people well enough to know because things do change. It's like I do an exercise I call pulse check twice a month. Everybody that's on any team that I'm working with, I send out a four-question kind of update. I don't want information to get behind on me. You know what I mean? If somebody's going through something, I don't find out if six months later, it's already shown up probably on my reports. I just didn't know why this lag was there. And so what I try to do is catch this stuff before it hits a report. And to do that, you just got to be more active in their lives, right? So I think that you've got to, to your point, I think you've got to set aside intentional time just for reflection and reset. Like, all right, we've gone through this year, and maybe you do it annually. I mean, that's up to you. Or maybe it's semi-annually. If there's adjustments and pivots and that need to be made, don't wait till it's too long to pivot. So I think that's the first idea is how do we stay fresh with people? Like, how do we have the conversations at times to where we're not missing out where they're going? Because if we miss out where they're going, they'll go without us. And so, what I want to do is I want to be I want to be early. Or to make a decision. I you've heard me talk about quiet quitting. These are one that this is one of the strategies that happen to people. You know, have you ever lost somebody and you caught it, you were caught off guard by it?

SPEAKER_02 45:38

Yeah, of course.

SPEAKER_01 45:38

Yeah, of course you have. And you go like, what happened? Well, what happens is we generally miss signs and signals that they're giving us because we've got 17,000 other things, and we hoped that they would be courageous enough to come to us and go like, Ty, but sometimes they don't. Sometimes they see the business of your life. I teach people how to be more alert to those signs and signals because Ty, once it hits your reports, your KPIs, your dashboards, it's a history lesson. I want to catch stuff early before it hits the report, before it affects the report performance, and before we're left with our hands up in the air, going like, what happened here? That's the key to us building a place that people want to stay in. We're ahead of them before they get to a place where we don't want them to be nor they want to be themselves. And so I think you having set aside time or a leader having set aside time where they go, like, hey, I want to stay fresh on where you're going. Like, where are you wanting to do? Where could you know, where are some adjustments that you're wanting to make so that maybe I again I go back to the analogy. Ty needs to spend time, owners need to spend time looking at the soil and then having the reflection conversations with the seed, their talent, to be able to see and make sure that well, I want to build uh, you know, I want to plant a redwood here. Well, dude, I can't plant a redwood here. The conditions aren't right, right? Like we don't grow redwoods here, we grow live oaks or whatever. And so as long as people have this level of understanding of each other, and boy, if I do anything that I think I'm proud of, it's that. I open up and unlock understanding about each other that whether we agree all the time or not, we understand where we're coming from and we accommodate that. I didn't say we allowed it, we accommodate it, we understood it, we are willing to be accountable to each other about that situation. And so let's unlock understanding of each other, and that's a good place to start.

Ty Cobb Backer 47:52

Yeah, I think that's such an important piece to all of this, Reggie. You know, to carve out enough time, you know, in your schedule to to get with those people that have been around for a while, you know, and plus it allows them to know that you didn't forget about them as well, and and sit there and listen to them and find out where they're at today. And and you know, it shows that your appreciation for them as well.

SPEAKER_01 48:16

Yeah, and go one, yeah, go one step further. Ask yourself this your next hire, this this is just for somebody to think about. Your next hire, before you started running indeed ads and getting recruiters involved and all that other kind of stuff, what if an owner went to his team and said, Hey, I've I've there's some deficiencies in our business here. We're wanting to hire what role, what what do you see this role? What is the next role we need to hire to accommodate our growth or fit into our strategy? And if you let people tell you, you're probably transitioning that new person coming in to be a whole lot easier because they've been a part of helping to carve out what this new person looks like. And so it's just how do you transition people from staying in an Airbnb at your business to a destination business? And to do that, you've got to give them feelings of ownership, and like, oh, okay, yeah, Ty does care. And I know you do this, that's why I'm picking on you. But that is Jana, is that right?

Ty Cobb Backer 49:23

Yep, Jana.

SPEAKER_01 49:25

Yeah, I'm old, but man, I still got a pretty good memory. Tell her hello for me.

SPEAKER_00 49:29

Oh well.

The Hidden ROI Of Retention

SPEAKER_01 49:30

But anyway, but anyway, I I think it the more we just bring people back together and start working together, and here's the biggest complaint I hear from people, Reggie. Culture, your talk is really motivational and inspirational, but there's no ROI on it. And that bugged me, if you want to know the truth, because it's they're like, these are soft skills, these are they're important skills, but Reggie, we gotta sell more, we gotta produce more, and we gotta collect more. Okay, great. So I've man, I beat my brains trying to figure out what's the ROI in this. Now, watch this. If you lose somebody, whether they quit or you quit for them, there is an associated cost to replace that person that nobody takes into account for, and for sure is an invisible line on your PL, no one notices. So, great, great, smarter people than I said this time. If you lose somebody by your choice or theirs, it takes you 20% of what you paid that person on top of what you paid that person last year. I'm sorry, 20% of what you paid some that person that left last year to replace them. So if you paid somebody$50,000, it's gonna cost you$10,000 to replace them. You gotta look at you gotta look at training, onboarding, recruiting, you know, you know, what losses you have because that seat's not filled. And if you take all of the circumstances that go into that loss, it's gonna cost you to replace them. But it doesn't show up on your PL. And so, but I I did this exercise the other night in a conversation I was in. I said, How many people do you lose last year? We lost three. What was the average pay? 60, or I think it was$60,000. So that's$180,000 that you spent. Now it's going to cost you 20% of that, which is$36,000 to replace these people. And here's the other statistic that mattered 85% of that could have been prevented. So don't tell me anymore that there's not a hard ROI to be considered, even though you can't sit on your PL, that could curb up a 20% respend just replacing people. And so there is a mathematical certainty to this loss that no one's paying attention to. And so, you know, you run a business, where can you go and find a 20% hole in your business and fix it by correction? They're hard to find, 20% losses. But now, if I can help you to early see some of this stuff early, and we can make some correction to it, and we can start accommodating it differently, we can get better clarification around it, and you stop losing people, you're filling a hole in the bucket of your money that stays now. Who doesn't want that? So, culture now and building a culture that people want to stay at has a tangible ROI to it that most have overlooked in the past.

Ty Cobb Backer 52:55

Amen. And that's that's a fact. That's that's not your opinion. That there is definitely you know a loss there, it's an invisible loss on your PL. And and you know, and I don't even know if that's even taking into consideration the time lost of training that person up and and the things that are falling behind and the and the other burden that it's putting on the other teammates too, because now they got to take over workload. Right, it's probably more than 20% in in actuality of what the ripple effect it is to come bring somebody new into your organization and get them up to speed to where that person was before they left.

See You Tomorrow And Why Not

SPEAKER_01 53:32

Yeah, yeah, and the drag on your team, it just is. You're yeah, you you said it, and I wasn't gonna say this because the real number scares people off. They go, like, this is not realistic, Reggie. Until you sit down and do the things that you you map out what you just said. We got onboarding, we got a training expense, we're running ads. You know, what about the lost productivity of that seat till we fill it? What drag does it put on my team? Because I don't I don't have that person. If you start calculating the cost, it is way more than 20%. But even if it was 20%, how many$10,000 refill costs are you going to continue before you go like, all right, how do we prevent this? And the way you prevent it is to build conditions inside of your business that people actually stick to, stay with, and are willing to uh make corrections and be accountable to that. That's what you want. And so, you know, I one of the things I ask people to do and I help them with is I go to your team and say, let me ask you something. Why in the world would you come back here tomorrow?

unknown 54:40

Right.

SPEAKER_01 54:41

I want to know why you keep coming and getting up and coming back. Because I it might the cry of my heart right now is to help people to see this statement as kind of a rally cry. And that is this, see you tomorrow. I got this t-shirt on. See y'all tomorrow. And if not, why not? I want more and more people that are part of a process and a company that they see growth and development in, and that the soil is open and it's willing to receive their talents and abilities so they can dream and not be afraid to dream without leaving. That's what I want. So that when I walk, have you? I'm I'm sure you've been to places where you've been like, dude, if I could stay here forever, I'd never want to leave. Why can't we have that in business? I told somebody the other night, if if you had to put me in one spot that I have been that I had to stay at the rest of my life and not complain today, what would that place be? And my answer was easy. It was Sea Island, Georgia. Most people don't even know where that's at, other than Georgia. But this facility was built 96 years before I even took my wife there. And the guy who built it had me in mind when he built it, knowing that there was a place that Reggie Brock, didn't know who Reggie Brock was, but he built a destination business that had this vibe to it that made me go, like, my God, if I could afford$1,500 a night to stay in this place, I'd keep coming back. The conditions were perfect, the food, the accommodations, everything. Golf course I could play forever. Ty, tell me why we can't build that same philosophy inside of our businesses where we just have built so much great experience with people and so much great experience with customers. They can't imagine doing whatever that is without us, and that's what I'm after.

Ty Cobb Backer 56:39

No doubt. No doubt it can happen, it is possible.

SPEAKER_01 56:42

It is for sure.

Ty Cobb Backer 56:44

No doubt.

SPEAKER_01 56:45

You've been a great example of that, and I I want to I want to honor you for that.

Ty Cobb Backer 56:49

Thank you. Thank you. It's not easy. Like I said, it's not static, it's definitely fluid, and and you know, it's it's as long as we we veer back to the center at some point in time, you know, and we can all meet on common ground. Like you said, it it starts with clarity and it it it and then the second piece of that is is communication.

SPEAKER_01 57:07

Yeah, and then you know uh you're right, and like my wife probably gonna be, I hope she don't hear this, but my wife didn't get pregnant because we were in separate rooms when you create something together, there's gotta be proximity that matters, and so we have got to drive people back to the middle so that this exchange that produces something together and apart starts with proximity. You can't let people run to silos and them to think, well, this is the safest place I can be. If they feel like they isolate themselves and separate themselves from each other far enough apart, they somehow seem safe. And it's just the opposite. How do we get people back to community and to culture that we all contribute to? And we all are willing to have differences of opinions, but it does not destroy us, it actually builds us to where we can do things beyond even our own imagination, and that's kind of uh how I see the opportunity for me in the fourth quarter of my life to be able to start shaking some trees and going, like, guys, hey, this is not just about systems and processes, this is about the spirit of the business, which is your people. How do we create something that just makes them want to come back and to keep contributing and wanted to pour into this objective that's bigger than them and they just want to be together? How do we do that? And I think I figured some stuff out finally, Ty.

Ty Cobb Backer 58:48

No doubt, man. It sounds like you have. I know you have. Awesome. Before we wrap, is there any any one last little gold nugget you want to leave us with?

SPEAKER_01 58:58

Yeah, so here's what I would say. I think we've got our business backwards. And I saw Gary V say something, and I don't I don't really follow him that much, but I I called and saw this clip and it reminded me of it. He said, one of the first principles that guy said, You think you're a great leader? And he goes, Well, yeah, I think I'm great. And he said, Why? And he said, Well, one of the reasons is I've realized that I people don't work for me, I work for them.

unknown 59:25

Amen.

SPEAKER_01 59:26

And he said, I'm honored that they would be here and that they would contribute to what vision I have. And it is up to me to make for sure they still want to be here tomorrow. And he said they could go different places because of their talent, but they're here. So here's what I would leave this audience with today. If you choose to serve before you're being served, you'll always have people wanting to give back to you. It's a law of reciprocity, it's the law of give and take. If the biggest problem we have now is we've got too many takers, we just take, take, take, take, take, take, take, and we just don't give enough. And so if you want to build a business that people actually want to come back to tomorrow, serve them first. And I think the world's telling us, hey, just 10x yourself, build through people. You got to just expect they're gonna come in and go, don't worry about it, just keep people flowing through and through, and you'll be fine. And the fact is, uh, at some point people need to be served. And I think one of the great aspects of leadership that I see today is where people build their business, they start their vision, is to start with how can I build something that serves the people in it with me and those that we're actually trying to serve as customers. That would be my kind of final thought, Ty.

Ty Cobb Backer 1:00:59

Boom. Powerful, man. That was so good. Reggie, man. I I appreciate you so much, man. I appreciate your wisdom and and your knowledge. That was just such such great, powerful stuff. So again, thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:14

Last thing I'll tell you this is if if someone is interested in maybe I'll do because if they've listened to this show, I will provide them an assessment for them and their leadership team free of charge, just to kind of give them an idea about how this kind of process starts. If they just reach out and contact me on and let me know they heard it on the show, I'm happy to do it because very, very thankful for you letting me be on with you today.

Ty Cobb Backer 1:01:41

Yeah, man, we're we're grateful you're here. What what's the best way for them to contact you?

SPEAKER_01 1:01:46

Yeah, so they just I'm you know, pretty well easy to find on social media. But if they'll just reach out to me and DM me, I mean they can find me on Facebook and then DM me, or they can find one of the other channels. And you know, I'm actually my website is Cultural Disruptor now, and so they can go to Reggie at Culturaldisruptor.com and you know there's a place they can fill some stuff out. But yeah, just reach out to me, find me, and we'll figure something out. And I'm happy to do that for you and your audience.

Ty Cobb Backer 1:02:13

Awesome, man. Awesome. That's great stuff. So and if this episode has brought any value to you or anyone else, make sure that you share this with somebody. Reach out to Reggie. You like he said, DM him. I think it what was it, www.reggiebrock.com. I think you got it.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:30

Yeah, they can do that too. Yep.

Ty Cobb Backer 1:02:32

Yep, yep. I saw that out there. And and thank you for for being on the show, Reggie. And thank you for what you're doing, man, and making a difference in this world.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:40

Thank you so much, Ty. I appreciate our friendship and you giving me this uh opportunity to be with y'all today. Thank you so much.

Ty Cobb Backer 1:02:46

Me too, thank you, my friend. Thanks. Bye bye. Bye.